Right. Right. Google follows the corporate culture. That's a short term. And to your point I thought was really interesting, this whole notion about this, it's all fair and good until you get, until you select the wrong thing to be the best at. Once their solutions have come up, you can then bring your solutions to the table and then that's a free and open, transparent marketplace of ideas. Because the whole point about having a sustainable long term business is having a critical mass of people who can lead. Facebook. It's basically another word for our target setting and goal setting. Top down isn't about being a, uh, you know, like a tyrant. Improves Employee Engagement . Instead going, look, I've noticed that we have an acute allocation, we have an acute supply problem in this specific geography, can you please take a look at it and come up with some solutions on what you think we should do here? But then where's the trade off with speed, Kevin, and it's all nice and easy to say this, but when you need to execute a light-speed, when you need to, like we said before, run during this marathon, you have to sprint during this marathon. Go-Jek has a board of directors and a board of commissioners, in accordance with the dual governance structure that's mandated by Indonesian law. For us at GO-JEK, culture is a collective philosophy about how to build products that change lives. Being given that freedom to even as an individual contributor to kind of figure it out and actually deliver something great, I think is definitely the kind of people that, you know, we try and have more and more of and we just kind of people that we want to appreciate because of, through this policy. Nadiem: Thanks a lot Kev, until next time. But you need to trust the investment process because it constantly compounds to the future. Like if imagine trying to start another just general video sharing platforms. Kevin: What artificial intelligence. I think that part is, I think, um, the next step of really kind of instituting these philosophies that generally sound good. Right? Jun 6, 2022. I feel exactly the same. Gojek launched its application in 2015 with . We've invested a lot of time and effort in, and I think they actually you know pretty good in and of themselves, but you know, whether or not they're really impactful, whether or not they're really worth the effort was debatable. Nadiem: It's not how quickly they get it done. So there's all these factors, but overall, as a general characteristic, some of the things that even I struggle with, by the way, so I'm not saying I, yeah, I'm very good at this as well. Kevin: So I think, I think in the early stages, it's, um, in the early stages, it's, it's really easy to do a top down without feeling bad about it. This meta-analysis, which comprises 43 studies with a combined sample size of 6341 organizations, reveals that Quinn and Rohrbaugh's Competing Values Framework provides a meaningful structure for the ideational aspects of organizational culture. Like I was pretty significant percentage requirement minimum. Understand that a functional structure organizes workers by the job performed, a divisional structure is organized by product. At GO-JEK, to overcome this, we encourage regular, short term movements from one team to another. We just did. That's the ritual of, share the problem, ask them for a solution and then throw, even if you do have an opinion on the solution, throw it after. As individuals and as a team, we never let ourselves get too comfortable whether its about knowing a piece of technology, scaling for hyper-growth or achieving new milestones every day. Its not unusual for a person to move teams to pick up a technology theyre interested i,n or pair on solving a common problem. Photograph by WeWork. You want to be the best that what truly matters must be passion agnostic. I think also a lot of, one of the reasons why this is one is challenging is because a lot of times people, people, leaders, then might feel insecure, right? Bringing them together, bringing out the best in them, and enriching your company culture in the process. Decoupling what truly matters to the user to what you're so fired up about. This has been a contentious kind of battle. It's going to do, you know, I'm going to do whatever, you know some, someone told me and, and I think you know, you, you also have smart people who kind of, or smart people who also fall in that category. It's just that they have, their team happens to do that really well. Culture matters because it boosts productivity, agility, employee engagement, and innovation. Nadiem: Right. I don't know why suddenly I'm so much more Kevin: Right? Jan 13, 2022. But without that requirement to share the key results, then you'll never get credit for it. You name it we do it. Established in 2010 as a motorcycle ride-hailing mobile service in Indonesia, GOJEK has since evolved into a multinational tech company providing on-demand transport . Like what's urgent, what is high leverage? Yeah. From the land of Jakarta - 20 motorcycle taxis, 1 call centre, and a mission to remove friction from peoples lives. It was good. Those issues happen. Right? Right? But the reason why we believe in them is because for the parts of the units of the organization that we did apply these principles. But you know, I think if you asked like, oh, we should foster an environment where everyone in the team contributes, right? Unknown problems. Um, I think it's very easy to fall in love with, you know, your solutions and your ideas or the things that you know, you particularly good at or you've, what you've been doing for a while. Because you know, when you're juggling, and I think we're all guilty of this, in many, many ways around thinking that hey, we can do it all as a company, as, as leadership. Kevin: I agree. What we did was we invited all the groups together so that peers could challenge and review and we had a whole section of how they can help the issues that they can help with for other groups. But these apps that connect drivers to passengers are creating competition for established. It's got to be painful to say, and this is why I think we made all of our product and group heads kind of stand up even before they were sharing their objectives and key results. And the third is some material incentive, right. I'm going to check it out first. Right? Investment Stage Late Stage Venture. I think that's dangerous, right? Like when you were at these places where you work and you just weren't listened to right. Ranked #11 on Fortunes top 50 companies that changed the world. 1. Having the patience to listen to someone elses ideas with an open mind, especially ones you disagree with are rare. Their most recent investment was on May 12, 2021, when CEO PT. Ranks 17th among Fortunes Top 20 companies that changed the world. Right. If you kind of look at the universe of companies. GoFood rated #1 user-friendly app during the pandemic. Pamela Chan. Like you, you need these self-driven individuals who are proactively finding the solution as opposed to simply executing it. You can then bring your solution. Cool. Nadiem: Debatable. Telkomsel and Telkomsel are the most recent investors. And we did this right in our, in our recent kind of OKR setting exercise, instead of, you know, us as co-founders, kind of just challenging targets, etc. When they're trying to raise something to me, I would like to hear, you know, I would like to hear, um, credit given to others. There was less lack of clarity in what product teams need to prioritize because their leader's just prioritize for them or we prioritize a for them. Like it's not, it's not just an ignorance of it. Or you have to constantly experiment by default, that means you have to fail most of the time. Which used to be our criteria back in the day. Yeah. Kevin: Well, I think a few things, right? Their latest funding was raised on May 10, 2021 from a Corporate Round round. And the first one, organizational investments. Yeah. Gojek is founded on the principle of using technology to remove life's daily frictions by connecting consumers to the best providers of goods and services in the market. Um, because you Nadiem: it's so fuzzy sometimes. Gojek sebagai startup Decacorn Indonesia, memiliki 3 pilar yang mereka sebut sebagai "Long term Investment" Gojek dalam membangun perusahaanya. We like to talk about things we like and talk about things we don't like. But it's how far are you willing to go to kind of make that happen? Whether you're looking to get across town, or even earning on the road, choose Gojek - we're the city's latest ride-hailing app dedicated to making your commutes all that much better. Yeah, right. Gojek has raised a total of $5.3B in funding over 13 rounds. Well, what for you, it's when, you know, you're trying to, when you're trying to raise something, right? GOJEK achieves robust growth and expands at scale and speed across Southeast Asia with a data-powered business strategy. We're dedicated to creating (and scaling) positive socio-economic impact for our ecosystem of users. Nadiem: And so let's talk a little bit about, I want to talk a little bit about what we actually did right in the organization to pay tribute to this bottom up innovation. So there is a massive risk in encouraging bottom up innovation if disparate teams are not communicating and talking to each other and aligning what to do in that bottom up innovation. Right. I think a lot of people are or a lot of listeners are wondering like is it really worth it? Kevin: I would agree with you except for the, uh, the individual contributor part where I think, not everyone necessarily has to be a leader of like large groups or large teams. Enter food delivery, ticket bookings, and more. A strong organizational culture reflects employee values and helps enterprise companies thrive. This is infused in the way we do a goal setting. And here's where it gets really tricky. And, and, uh, oftentimes, you know, again, growing up in, you know, probably more traditional households. That's right. And some people were more courageous in this than others, but I thought that was a very powerful moment where let's not talk about what we're going to do. Parameters - Brand loyalty, media engagement, and CSR. Right. And the third theme is about building bridges and breaking walls within the organization, which is about alignment and communication. All the time. Nadiem: And all these hows. And you're beat, you're there. Right. And I'm always really amazed at you know companies that will say like, okay, this is one thing we're really going to nail. Right. It's hard and, it's hard in any kind of fast paced industry, right? Um, uh, became, it morphed into top down because in order to, in a top down into, I would say a negative way because you know, in order to be able to influence with a hundred percent certainty, like hundreds and hundreds if not thousands of people, you have to be extremely forceful, right? That makes them feel more safe. Twitter. And then suddenly like a product just like leaps in terms of just quality, uh, you know, about like a year or two years after that. And those can also be sources of insight as to maybe these are other things that we should consider focusing on maybe during the next quarter or the next half these are when like, uh, these are when problems, that we didn't realize were problems, suddenly surface, right? Nadiem: I just got it done. And I think that that part is, yeah, I agree with you that that is, that is probably one of the harder ones where you can actually, cause it's hard to see that, oh, this thing that, you know, I'm really fired up about it. The Competing Values Framework describes value systems based on two main dimensions. Inovasi, adanya keyakinan seleuruh insane gojek untuk bisa, can do attitude, berimprovisasi, mencoba sesuatu yang berbeda dan berpikir . The other is fear. And obviously, you know. I don't know. That's just noise. There are very, very many good benevolent dictators in tech companies out there, right? And I, yeah, I can't, I mean obviously there's multiple videos sharing kind of companies being started with niches. How would you approach like, your kind of parenting style with respect to this, right. Theyre often reduced to a binary absolute: The Magical Team, or the Useless team. Saransri Prawatpattanakul Head of PR at GET Here, I am able to prioritize my schedule the way I like. And what's really interesting about it is that all these hows have no short term payoffs. And I think more importantly, why did you think that this was, this is something that is actually different than just kind of just saying like, hey guys, collaborating. So what I've realized is that the best bottom up leaders will never do that. Kevin: So what do you think then is the, in this framework, right? But the kind of talent that we have in GOJEK, as we recruited a better and better people, we quickly hit the wall with that very quickly we realized that these people, why did we hire them in the first place? I mean, we, we, I mean the last, what, four years, uh, we just kind of held on, right? Speed (kecepatan), dalam melakukan segala sesuatu gojek mengerjakannnya dengan cepat. Who says change needs to be hard? Long term success takes a lot of sacrifice in the short term. Social Impact Transform lives, inspire change. Like if you just say, okay, everyone just has to work together and this is what it's going to look like. . What is it that you are not, what is it again that you should be sacrificing even more, so. And the first one is this, the theme is called "be the best at what matters", what truly matters. And I think it's much easier for companies to ignore this fact, but if you get that right in the beginning, there's your probability of success. Organizational culture is the set of underlying beliefs, values, principles, and ways of interacting within an organization. Gojek becomes Indonesias first unicorn. This is one thing that I think all companies, including ourselves are consistently terrible at consistently. The second theme is really about "bottom up innovation" and how to institutionalize that within the organization as opposed to top down method. Yeah, exactly. And that inherently blocks bottom up because it means that the people under this person can rise up because then they never get the credit that they deserve. Series F funding from Google, Tencent, JD.com and Mitsubishi. Right? And you also have to be a very effective collaborator to do that. It's rare, but it is possible. Let's talk about what we're not going to do. Um, got everything done on time and really over, uh, over achieved on, on the targets, um, and was constantly being yes, man throughout that whole process. Kevin: Right. The CEO of Gojek shares his lessons of creating a principled culture, managing organizational debt, and building true moats. Tell us why it matters and tell us what you're going to be sacrificing. An organizational structure is a visual representation of what employees do, who they report to, and how business decisions are made. In all companies. And that's a very powerful statement. So if you're, if you, if you don't have that mental resilience to know that your baby could be irrelevant, yeah. Know our journey, and the people behind it. Right? Some, some people we used to call it and management consultant and we used to call it KPIs. But in the bigger scheme of things, it's not what truly matters to their end user. Right. Kevin: Correct. Nadiem: Like they want to be the best at recommendations. Right? Yeah. GoFood rated #1 user-friendly app during the pandemic. GOJEK does ride hailing, food delivery, payments even on demand massages. And that's okay. I'm thinking what's next? Move Marketing A. So make those painful moves early. I think, um, I think what we've seen, are there's a different flavors of it. So that's where the challenge I think is also kind of getting the incentives. In this article, we'll explore what organizational culture is, how . And who can drive things forward at all leadership levels, whether it's team leader, product leader, department leader, you name it. And that just doesn't work. There is a cultural payoff in an organization for helping another group out or another team out even though it doesn't directly fall under yours, but we took some forcing like some really, really interesting policy changes from processes that we took forth as a result of this. This one's good about focus and prioritization. According to MomentumWorks, this is the structure of the board of directors: Founders CEO and founder Nadiem Makarim who holds 58,416 shares, accounting for 4.81% of the total shares. Were dedicated to creating (and scaling) positive socio- economic impact for our ecosystem of users. Nadiem: Yeah. Yeah. Intro: Welcome to GO FIGURE. Like I think maybe bottom up innovation is a very specific one. Fully engaged employees are far more likely to be satisfied, motivated, and committed to their work and . I think just forcing, just saying that, hey, collaborate more without it being bottom up I think probably makes top down worse, right? You can see this happening in our every day conversations. Copy link. But that enabled this OKR setting process to be much more bottom up. You might have solutions in your head and that's fine. Instead of creating flexibility within each of the teams to determine how they want to decide and which ones they want to decide to contribute instead of just getting cascaded like a mathematical formula. Like, I mean, growing up I think we all were, and then, and, kids who probably question authority. Uh, but then it just didn't, it, it didn't matter. The three pillars of Gojek Speed Move fast, push boundaries. For us at GO-JEK, culture is a collective philosophy about how to build products that change lives. Kevin: Yes, of course I was like, Oh yeah, okay, we got this, we got this. And it doesn't have to be me who's like more on the end of the entrepreneurial scale. Semakin baik organizational culture yang dimiliki oleh perusahaan, maka kian mudah pula meraih kesuksesan. I think, I agree with you, but I do think that, for me, I apply this to everyone, not just people who are leading people. Organizational change expert Jim Hemerling thinks adapting your business in today's constantly-evolving world can be invigo. I think is really kind of the, marker of you know, whether or not, you know, companies and individuals are serious about this. Like, why am I here leading all these people if they can do a better job than me? Massive moats. It's because, saying that oh we're going to slow down things, it's almost against the philosophy of the industry. An organization's culture defines how individuals work and function within a company, making organizational culture a crucial element of a company's ultimate success. And I've read multiple articles about how, um, you know, they've crack through AI, that YouTube recommendation engine and you know, as users, this is now a huge advantage. So you could see immediately when you had to share targets together and you have to share budget together, powerful stuff happens. It's like, okay, if I am the leader here, I am the most senior person within this group of other people and I am not the one who's coming up with the ideas and I am not the one that's getting credit for making the right calls or coming up with the right ideas, then what is my value? And you instantly saw the energy in the room whereby it wasn't just leader saying, oh, I like that. It's like a learning hub, right? The more that people below you come up with better ideas, the more you know you're on the right path. Gojek (then GO-JEK) begins to paint the town green. Right. Kevin: Yup. I don't have to think, because as long as I said my boss did it, I'm safe. What do you think is the ultimate sacrifice? GET allows me to have initiative and be creative. Nadiem: but that's the difference, right? And I think the good sign of a bottom up leader is one that is secure in knowing that their job is to provide the platform and distill from their team, you know, the best ideas. Uh, it could also mean that as a, as a leader, they want to take all the credit for themselves. Mario Gabriele. So it's when the shit hits the fan, that actually this concept of ownership and bottom up innovation shine, right. 1. Review the different organizational structures most commonly used. Kevin: And so you see like the, that payoff, right? It's very hard to recover after that. Right. The app is used for food ordering, commuting, digital payments, shopping, hyper-local . Right? If you just focus on output numbers, then at a certain point, those output numbers like revenues, sustainability, all of this other stuff might go down over time if you're not investing in the long term leading indicators of health in an organization. Nadiem: The compound. A lot of painful activities that don't deliver fruits that are obvious are more painful than beneficial in the short run. He's like, what? That's exactly the, the, you know, the concept of not being able to have agency or control over your thing when you know that you are capable, that's a difference. Making that extra effort to learn, listen and grow together. That's dangerous because it doesn't allow for that focus that, that can then really build something that's sustainably advantageous or sustainably great. Especially because, you know when the, then the company is like 30 people all in the same room, even top down doesn't feel very top down, right? So when I go and say, Hey, can you do this? And the research and the data is very important as well. And then we come to the third kind of strategic theme, which is be the best at what matters. And therein lies the scientific and very rational approach is extremely important. And, and there were some clear benefits to that. Either way, it makes engagement and collaboration difficult, because nobody empathises with an ideal. Strong Communication and teamwork trans-sectored is wanted in the Corporate Culture at Google. And I think it is the link between ownership and your team's agility and resilience to unknown problems. My name is Nadiem Makarim, CEO and founder of GOJEK Southeast Asia's first Super App. Like instead of going up, Oh Kevin, you've got this major issue with allocation in this one city, I need you to immediately pump up incentives right now by this percent so that we can hit a BCR of this percent. Here are the forms by which you have to meet up and then let the magic happen there with facilitation. Better rides coming your way. Move Engineering, Merchant EcoSys. And you know, let's, let's focus on, you know, other things. How well and how quickly can I do it? Sense-making has been. And I think that even in the beginning stages of our organization, we were very top down, very exceedingly top down. Uh, what is obviously the, that, that, that ownership. Nadiem: yeah, when, when things are bad, you have to, yeah. Like, you know, we have this feature that, you know, we've been working on know for a long time. 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